February 12, 2007
GUESS I'LL START RIOTING IN PROTEST
Most TV opinion shows have the decency to have at least one person from each side of the issue they're discussing. When they don't, it makes them look a little catty.
Like this clip from Paula Zahn's show that I found via Hot Air (and an e-mail from Frank J. of IMAO), where they discussed their final solution to the atheist problem without having an atheist on the panel.
First, ya gotta love those big, yellow, hornets'-nest-stirring questions in the background:
"Why do atheists inspire such hatred?"
and
"Are atheistic tactics too militant?"
Jerks.
Anyway, it occurs to me that just as non-terrorist Muslims need to speak out, condemn, and separate themselves from the splodey-dope lunatics who claim to be members of the same religion, I - as a tolerant, sane, non-evangelical atheist - need to do the same thing.
When people talk about atheists, they usually think about the frothing, blasphemous, God-hating, religion-mockers. People who write screedy, antagonistic diatribes like Russ of Pam's House Blend.
I just don't understand that stuff.
I think most people agree that in-your-face Christian evangelicals can be annoying with their constant fretting about the state of your soul, and their polite-but-condescending invitations to Bible studies. It's like having your 70-year-old mother who lives in another state calling you before you go to work to remind you to take an umbrella because the Weather Channel says it looks like rain.
Thanks for caring, but really, I'm good, here.
But why should atheists adopt the same tactic, going out of their way to antagonize Christians? It's a waste of time. You're not going to de-convert anyone. Try doing something productive with your life.
Personally, I'm not so insecure about my lack of religious beliefs that I feel the need to sway people to my way of thinking, and I'm not afraid of or offended by the little scraps of Christianity that poke their heads up in day to day living, like having "IN GOD WE TRUST" on the back of my currency. Let's face it, no one's ever said to me "You must be a Christian because the money you're spending professes trust in a deity".
And just because I don't believe in God doesn't mean I think that "love thy neighbor" and "do unto others" must automatically be bad advice. I believe in wisdom, regardless of the source. I just don't believe in miracles.
So you go ahead and worship your God, and I'll go ahead and not worship mine, and as long as neither one of us are obnoxious about it, I don't see any reason why we all can't get along.
Posted by: Harvey at
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I consider myself an agnostic instead of an atheist, simply because nobody's been able to conclusively prove to me there ISN'T a god either. That said, I tend to judge people's religious beliefs by the extent that they leave me the fuck alone. If you want to believe that I'll burn for eternity, fine, have fun imagining my suffering: I don't give a shit.
When you start passing laws based of your beliefs that affect my lifestyle (IE: Bullshit "no liquor before noon on Sundays" laws) I start to get pissed.
If you show up at my house before 10am on a Saturday, you had best have beer or a warrant. A copy of Watchtower magazine ain't going to spare my wrath.
When you call me infidel and say you want to cut off my head if I don't convert to your religion, I start tipping my ammo in pig fat so I can send every one of you camel humping shitheads I see to hell.
Likewise, when an atheist screeches that a Christmas tree anywhere in sight offends them and it needs to be taken down, I wasnt to bitchslap their fucking teeth down their throats.
Leave me alone, and we'll get along fine.
I have a lot of respect for the Bhuddists and Wiccans for this very reason. Think about it: when was the last time you saw a headline like "Wiccan suicide bomber kills 5" or "Bhuddist kidnaps and beheads schoolchildren"?
Posted by: Graumagus at February 12, 2007 10:33 AM (LV+mK)
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I think the majority of people Christian and atheist fall into the category of live and let live - especially in America today. It's that fringe group on either side that will drive us all insane because they insist on shoving their beliefs down everyone's collective throat.
As for Paula Zahn... she wants ratings and having a one sided screed going will get people to pay attention to her show - for better or worse. Personally I try not to listen to that crap. *grin*
Posted by: Teresa at February 12, 2007 11:19 AM (gsbs5)
Posted by: Richmond at February 12, 2007 02:38 PM (e8QFP)
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Um...
If one is going to hold to an irrational belief system (that would be atheism), one must not get bent out of shape when the people who agree with that irrational belief system act irrationally. It's kind of a logical necessity for them to do so.
Using only logic, reason, and real observational science, proving the existence of *A* creator takes about 20 minutes of a person's time. Worshiping that logically necessary being is only logical, since one owes one's entire existence to that logically necessary creator.
Am I the only one who sees a problem with holding to a religion (atheism most certainly IS a religion...) that justifies the murder of over 100 million people in just one century? The lack of *A* creator is necessary for Communism, National Socialism, 'global warming', Socialism, Totalitarianism, Fascism, and Anarchism (not really anarchy, but, we'll use their idiotic name for it). Other than that, there really isn't anything wrong with atheism.
The existence of *A* creator is necessary for freedom, liberty, and capitalism. Other than that, it doesn't really have anything going for it.
Posted by: The Humble Devildog at February 12, 2007 07:36 PM (Njev1)
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Wait... are you saying Paula Zahn's an atheist? :-)
Posted by: Harvey at February 12, 2007 07:54 PM (L7a63)
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Calling one's self a Christian and then acting like an atheist would tend to lead others to believe that you are actually an atheist.
In addition, without watching the video (Paula Zahn isn't too hard on the eyes, but, that's about her only redeeming quality), I could very easily make the argument that atheists WERE represented on the panel...by Paula Zahn.
There are a microscopic amount of non-atheists in the mainstream media outlets (and I include Fox News in that...they're only conservative by comparison), so, it would be safe to assume that any major personality in the MSM would be an atheist, unless otherwise informed.
When 98% or so of a demographic holds to certain beliefs, it's not a wise bet to assume one of that demographic will NOT hold to those beliefs.
Posted by: The Humble Devildog at February 12, 2007 08:26 PM (Njev1)
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I'll pray for you all!
Posted by: wRitErsbLock at February 13, 2007 07:53 AM (+MvHD)
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For the most part, we Catholic-types don't tend to preach on street corners or knock on doors, but we do pray and hope for our friends... I'm frequently surprised at how
misunderstood the Catholic faith is, sometimes (and sometimes
especially) even by other 'Cradle-Catholics'.
I was raised Catholic - sometimes even 'against my will'. When I rebelled, I was
accused of being atheist, and I discovered to my own chagrin that neither was that the case. I settled on agnosticism for a while - even studied other religions to see if I could find a better 'fit'... For rebellion's sake, I even delved into Wicca and the Occult.
Personally, I think each person has their own journey. "There are as many paths to Heaven as there are people to walk them."
Right now, I'd definitely say I'm not the best Catholic among the ranks - I'm suffering what amounts to a self-imposed separation from the sacraments. I've actually been pretty pissed at God lately. But I have a feeling He understands...
I do know that I've experienced some powerful moments of faith in my life. "Miracles" that I can't deny, and true evil, too. Of the two, Evil exists in undeniable abundance in this world - and perhaps ironically, it is THAT which gives me reason to Hope...
*slaps and shakes head 'loose'*
Whoa, Dude! I never thought I'd go
there on Bad Example!
/Jeff Spicoli moment
Posted by: Bitterroot at February 13, 2007 08:19 AM (NfSVQ)
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From my perspective, Catholicism has one good thing going for it - LOTS of ritual. And rituals have a lot of comfort value, especially during hard times.
Posted by: Harvey at February 13, 2007 08:28 AM (L7a63)
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Plus they have that giant spider...
(ducks and runs as the catholics who get the South Park reference start throwing things at me)
Posted by: Graumagus at February 13, 2007 11:06 AM (S1gMo)
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Damn Grau - now I have to go hunt the "giant spider," 'cuz I have absolutely no idea...
I'll deal with YOU later!
Posted by: Bitterroot at February 13, 2007 12:17 PM (bxLrF)
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For what it's worth, I have noticed that just about every single atheist or agnostic I know used to be Catholic, or came from a Catholic family.
Not a lot of former Presbyterians out there among the ranks.
I wonder if there's a connection? Yeah, there is.
Posted by: The Humble Devildog at February 13, 2007 08:00 PM (Njev1)
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Well, by sheer statistics, there are far more Catholics (25.9% pop.) than Presbyterians (2.8%). So you have more chance of meeting a former Catholic than a former Presbyterian atheist/agnostic. And I would suspect that more non-Catholics convert to Catholicism than Catholics becoming atheist or agnostic. (And so many of those former Catholics 'turn-back' as they face death...probably, like Harvey said, because of the comfort of the rituals.) Frankly, however, if I wasn't Catholic, I would want to be Jewish.
But I believe in live and let live. I don't think God keeps a scorecard. And if there is no God, it doesn't really matter WHAT you believe. Just play nice.
Posted by: Mrs. Who at February 13, 2007 10:49 PM (9FXen)
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Okay, so I'm ruminating this religious stuff shortly after having been branded a "Super Geek" and the 'slogan' enters my head...
"CathoLinux: We Are
root!"
Heh. I'm putting that one on a T-Shirt.
Posted by: Bitterroot at February 13, 2007 10:52 PM (9FXen)
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Last church I attended regularly was Baptist.
But I was like 7, so that probably doesn't count.
Posted by: Harvey at February 13, 2007 11:06 PM (L7a63)
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September 05, 2006
BOOK REVIEW: THE BLOG OF WAR
The first time
I ever reviewed anything written by Matty O'Blackfive, I had this to say:
...the setup is overly long, and the first part probably should've been in a separate post and shortly summarized before the more relevant part of the story.
In other words, "shut up, boy... ya talk too much".
After I got to meet him in person, I found out that that was a feature, not a bug. Matt's a born story-teller, and - since he's of Irish descent - I assume that he not only kissed the Blarney Stone, he may have given it more than a little tongue in the process.
However, when it comes to his book ("The Blog of War", by Matthew Currier Burden, paperback, 304 pages, available at Amazon.com) he does an amazing thing: aside from various introductions and the Epilogue, he actually shuts up and lets other people do the talking. You'll never see that in REAL life, so you might want to buy the book just for that experience alone.
On the other hand, those of you who know Matt also know how much he enjoys name-dropping. In this book, he does little but. What it lacks in personal loquacity, it makes up for in shout-outs to folks both in and closely related to the military.
Which is appropriate, since it's their stories that he's telling in his book - told in their own words and often taken directly from their own blog posts - with very short introductions by Matt. These are arranged in chapters according to various aspects of the war experience, summarized below:
1 - "Some Must Go To Fight The Dragons" - Setting the stage for the rest of the book by dealing with the broad, philosophical reasons why some men chose to put their life on the line to answer their nation's call. This chapter - like many of the others - is hard to read. Not because it's poorly written, but because it's written so well. It's hard on the heart, and touches the reader's deepest core
2 - "Life In A War Zone" - Very earthy, very gritty, very you-are-there tales from the front line. I imagine that to civilians, some of the oddball fuck-aroundery in NCO Alley will seem incomprehensible, but those with military experience will be able to relate and will get a huge kick out of it. I don't know if I'll ever get that "like a coyote ravishing a housecat" line out of my head.
3 - "The Healers" - Tells exactly WHY war is hell, in heart-rending, blood-soaked detail. If you don't tear up, wince, or flinch away from the book at least once during this chapter, I'd suggest getting your soul checked, because I would question your humanity.
4 - "Leaders, Warriors, and Diplomats" - There's a lot of talk about "winning hearts and minds" in this war. The newspapers will never explain what that actually means. This chapter does. You'll see soldiers winning with a cool head instead of a hot hand, and perhaps you'll come away with a better understanding of the fact that war isn't all about killing. It's about accomplishing the mission, however that needs to be done.
5 - "The Warriors" - I'm going to be understated. This - in clear and disturbing detail - is what good men have to do to keep you safe. If you ever meet one of these men, thank him. Profusely.
6 - "Heroes of the Homefront" - Another "hard on the heart" chapter. This is the hell the families left stateside have to go through to keep you safe. If you ever meet them, thank them also.
7 - "The Fallen" - Unlike the other chapters, you KNOW how the stories in this one will end. There is no way to thank these men. They are gone. All you can do is honor them by cherishing the freedoms they bought for you with their lives, and never forgetting what they've done.
8 - "Homecoming" - As much as our troops want to be out of the war zone, the transition back to life in the safe, civilized United States is rife with mixed emotions and conflicting feelings. For our troops, it's one final battle to win the war inside themselves.
As for the epilogue... well, you remember how Animal House ended? With little snippets of "where are they now?"
Somehow, I'm not surprised Matt used this technique himself.
Teasing aside, I think it was an excellent idea to give some closure with the people the reader has come to know and care about. Well done.
I'll also mention that there's a handy glossary for military terms and acronyms. You probably won't need it, though, since Matt and the contributors did a pretty good job of defining the terms as they came up. Even the greenest of civilians will be able to avoid getting lost in the terminology.
So... were there any bad parts? Is this review going to be nothing but ass-kissing suck-uppery of Matt's brilliance?
Not really, and mostly. The only thing I could find to complain about is that a few of Matt's introductory paragraphs are written - for no discernable reason - in present tense instead of past tense. I realize that's a bit of nit-picking on my part, but I stand by it. I also lay the blame for it squarely on the shoulders of the book's editor, who should have corrected it before the book went to press.
However, that and the occasiona minor typo (possibly in the original posts being reprinted) will likely pass completely unnoticed by the reader, since the stories themselves are too gripping to leave awareness left over for grammatical niceties.
Do I recommend this book?
Yes.
If you support the war, but don't know anyone personnally who's serving overseas, you owe it to yourself - out of intellectual honesty, if nothing else - to read this to find out EXACTLY what it is you're supporting.
If you enjoy reading warbloggers, you will enjoy the familiar, blog-entry-like style of the tales contained within. It reads so much like a blog, I sometimes found my hand twitching to try to click a link. No book has ever cried out more to be published in a fully hyper-linked electronic format.
If you've served overseas, you should read it so that you can see whether you should nod your head in agreement or call "bullshit" over an inaccurate description (of which I suspect there will be very few). I'd be curious to see whether those in-the-know think Matt got it right.
Who would I not recommend this book to?
Those with delicate constitutions. There's plenty of coarse language and adult situations. I'd give it a good, solid R rating. Definitely not for children or the child-like.
On the other hand, I also think everyone should buy this book so that Matt can quit his crappy day job and go to blogging full time. Which would be a wonderful thing.
Even if he does talk too much ;-)
Posted by: Harvey at
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Harvey,
This is really one of funniest and best reveiws I have read (nudge, much better than Frank J's)
Anyway, first thing that comes to mind, I will never ask you for a blog critique...
I also think that the out-clicking thing...well it happens when bloggers meet live, folks just click and walk...
Anyway, thanks for actually reading and reveiwing the book.
I cannot make it past the Fallen Chapter, I am stuck...
Feeling lucky and guilty again...
Posted by: armywifetoddlermom at September 05, 2006 09:04 PM (NJwsD)
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Matt a name-dropper? say it isn't so!!! I never noticed that, I mean, I heard from my dear friends former senators Nunn and Miller that he used his association with ME to crash Sir Elton John's birthday party for Gwynneth Paltrow last week at the Applebees in Dawsonville, but I don't know. I couldn't make it what with housesitting for the Indigo Girls.
Posted by: RSM at September 05, 2006 09:07 PM (hz+BK)
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Good Job Harvey. Good Job.
Posted by: Tammi at September 05, 2006 09:33 PM (3UQTn)
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RSM - Dude! I don't know how many times I have to tell you - It was Senator Dole! Get it right man or I'll have to tell Bruce Willis to stop talking to you the next time you're hanging at Denzel's place. Capisce?
Harv - thanks! You DID read it!
Posted by: Blackfive at September 05, 2006 10:09 PM (PfeKM)
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"occasiona minor typo"...yeah, guess we ALL know about those, huh??!!
Posted by: TNT at September 05, 2006 10:28 PM (L7a63)
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TNT - It's the Grammar Critic's Corollary to Murphy's Law that any criticism of grammatical, spelling, or typographical errors will, itself, contain such an error.
Posted by: Harvey at September 05, 2006 10:38 PM (L7a63)
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I think you've got it exactly right Harvey. I'd link to this - but my blog is gone for the moment... figures - just when I might have something to say. *grin*
Posted by: Teresa at September 06, 2006 09:06 AM (o4pJS)
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Since trackbacks aren't working... let's see if this works...
PING!
Posted by: Teresa at September 06, 2006 06:00 PM (o4pJS)
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Fuckroundery? Is that what it is called?
Posted by: armywifetoddlermom at September 07, 2006 08:13 AM (NJwsD)
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Harvey,
Airborne! All the Way!! Great review, now this old paratrooper has to buy the book. Well, if it helps Matt, that's good, because Matt helps all of us veterans. God bless!
"A sniper is a soldier highly trained in fieldcraft and marksmanship, who delivers long range precision fire at selected targets from concealed positions in support of combat operations." Top Team, XVIII ABN Corps Sniper Course, Class 3-86
Posted by: Alan Briley, RN at September 07, 2006 09:16 AM (CPg0u)
Posted by: Harvey at September 07, 2006 11:31 AM (L7a63)
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Harvey,
Great review. Thanks for the great slice o'Matty, and for that giving us the term "*uck-aroundery" for what often passes for what goes on.
Posted by: dadmanly at September 07, 2006 12:55 PM (TMDZm)
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Heather Mills-McCartney testifies at the trial of a photographer accused of assaulting her...
Posted by: Branden Blythe at June 22, 2007 12:45 AM (g9wuu)
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The late George Harrison and comic book creator Stan Lee will receive stars on Hollywood&aposs Walk of Fame...
Posted by: Dario Hardy at June 22, 2007 03:17 PM (d0i5p)
Posted by: hghcjoq at July 19, 2007 03:52 AM (HmmYL)
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August 29, 2006
IS THERE ANYTHING PEOPLE *WON'T* SAY TO GET THEIR 15 MINUTES?
David Frum is talking about the Hezbollah Hundreds again. And he's talking out of his ass. For example:
Only one thing was missing--the thin wire security strip that runs from top to bottom of a genuine US$100 bill. The money Hezbollah was passing was counterfeit, as should have been evident to anybody who studied the photographs with due care.
I assume he's talking about the one single picture that shows a $100 bill with light passing through it, which I discussed in a previous post
As I said before, I don't think the picuture is clear enough to be definitive.
He goes on to brag about how "SnappedShots.com, MyPetJawa and Charles Johnson's Little Green Footballs" pointed out the counterfeiting:
These [blog] sites magnified photographs and showed them to currency experts and detected irregularity after irregularity in the bills.
I'm calling bullshit. Other than the questionable "absence" of a security strip, there was nothing in any of the pictures I saw which indicated that those notes were counterfeit. American currency is subject to wide variations in ink color and seal placement, and all the notes I saw were within spec.
I'm putting out a challenge: if there's anyone who can point out any "irregularites" BESIDES the crispness of the notes, the security strip in that ONE picture, ink color, or seal placement, (all of which I address in the earlier post mentioned above) please bring it to my attention, I'll tell you whatever I can based on my considerable currency-handling experience.
And for heaven's sake, use direct URL's that work.
A final thought, because I want to be very clear on this point. I'm NOT saying these bills are genuine. I'm saying that I haven't seen enough evidence to declare them counterfeit. Unlike these so-called "currency experts" who are, in my opinion, simply taking advantage of the situation to gain a little ego-stroking from the media.
[Hat tip to reader Larwyn for pointing out Frum's article to me]
Posted by: Harvey at
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I don't think I know anyone who has claimed the Hezbollah bills to be counterfeit. What I have seen is the posed question of suspicion and the examination of web pix, which at 72 dpi is pretty lousy reference. Then, for me, that spurred research on who might be responsible IF the money were found to be fake - possibilities of course Iran and Korea. That led to research on Supernotes, which Treasury and State has been pursuing.
But known supernotes smuggling or laundering may be an entirely different thread of counterfeiting than money that shows up in Lebanon.
For me, the question became one of hoping the MSM or people in position to obtain Hezbollah bills might raise this to a level of examination. (That's why I emailed Israeli bloggers, closer the situation.)
I know when I looked at a lot of bills on the Internet, I could make comments, about signatures but not about true authenticity.
The question was always - where did they get those crisp bills?
Posted by: Sticky Notes at August 29, 2006 06:46 PM (+aC/q)
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Looked to me like David Frum was claiming that the blogsphere had proven that the bills were fakes, flatly stating, "The money Hezbollah was passing was counterfeit".
And you're right about the important question: where's is coming from. There are two possible answers - they're making it themselves OR they have backing from folks who have hundreds of thousands (perhaps millions) in cash just laying around, and prefer to spend it on supporting terrorists.
I'm not sure which answer is more disturbing.
Posted by: Harvey at August 29, 2006 10:34 PM (L7a63)
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August 26, 2006
MY CONCLUSION ON THE "HEZBOLLAH HUNDREDS"
I've been chatting with
Sticky Notes about whether Hezbollah is passing out fake $100's, and,
as I said earlier, I'm not inclined to believe they're fake.
But if that money IS genuine, that leads me to another thought:
That cash is a few years old, and it's still in like-new condition. Whoever is bankrolling this operation is well-funded enough to let large stacks of US currency sit around untouched for years.
This is no grass-roots relief effort. There's a major player involved. Who that might be, I don't have enough information to speculate on, but it narrows down to a question of "what source of Hezbollah funding could afford to sit on hundreds of thousands or even millions of dollars in cash without needing to spend it?"
Whoever it is needs to have their assets frozen until they decide that terrorism is not a good investment.
Interestingly enough, Sticky Notes speculates that if they ARE fake (which I admit they might be - I can't tell for sure without actually touching them), she might have a guess as to their source.
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Replace "freeze their assets" with "make them need that money to replace the infrastructure wiped out courtesy of the USAF" and I agree wholeheartedly.
Posted by: Graumagus at August 26, 2006 11:35 PM (C99u6)
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Oh... that's what I
meant... sorry about the typo :-)
Posted by: Harvey at August 27, 2006 09:30 AM (L7a63)
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Harvey,
I just noticed this article, so sorry for not responding sooner. I don't think it's fair to characterize the posts at Snapped Shot as being made "just for the sake of 15 minutes" of fame. I raised a question about this latest "charity" based on Hezbullah's potential criminal history, and followed up as more information came in.
As you'd see, if you looked over the website, I quickly retracted *every single one* of my allegations about the counterfeiting, as you and others who are more knowlegable about currency than I am commented and provided counter-examples. (I don't readily carry $100 bills, so I wasn't in a position to do any comparisons by myself.) The fact that Frum cited my website as definitive proof that the money was counterfeit had nothing to do with me—he did so for reasons which only he can explain. He certainly made no attempt to contact me before publishing his article!
Check out the latest article on Snapped Shot—a journalist *in Lebanon* has written with details about Hezbullah's financial operations which further invalidate my suppositions about counterfeiting—all of which has been posted as breaking news on Snapped Shot.
(your blog is mis-interpreting my URL and rejecting it as spam. Replace the "----" in the following hostname with "shot" to hit the link
http://www.snapped----.com/archives/115-Mike-Hornbrook-from-CBC-Hezbullah-Cash-is-REAL.html
15 minutes, indeed...
Regards,
Brian
Posted by: Brian C. Ledbetter at August 31, 2006 02:05 PM (Pkdud)
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Urgh. Good ol' browser address cache.
I meant to reply to your OTHER article, "IS THERE ANYTHING PEOPLE *WON'T* SAY TO GET THEIR 15 MINUTES?"
http://badexample.mu.nu/archives/194455.php
Sorry for the mixup!
Regards,
Brian
Posted by: Brian C. Ledbetter at August 31, 2006 02:08 PM (Pkdud)
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June 23, 2006
IT AIN'T EASY BEING GREAT
The Humble Devildog of Random Firings of Neurons listened to his music collection and
contemplated the causes of "greatness".
To me, the most notable aspect of great men is that they possess an insane and fanatical devotion to the pursuit of their goals. The spend what normal people consider "too much" time doing what they love.
In the cases he cites, it's music. They spent too much time reading it, writing it, and playing it. And they created a large body of crappy and forgettable work in the process. Most people wouldn't be able to continue after producing those tons of worthless garbage - they'd think "I can't do any better than this. I might as well give up."
But the greats kept on trying anyway. "Luck", after all, is when hard work meets opportunity.
They probably had a LOT of people tell them "There's more to life than just music. Why don't you get out once in a while? Get a hobby. Learn to play golf or something".
Thankfully, these idiots were ignored.
Of course, producing large quantities of crap does NOT guarantee eventual greatness (see my 6000 or so blog posts for proof), but greatness simply can't be done without it.
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"possess an insane and fanatical devotion to the pursuit of their goals. The spend what normal people consider "too much" time doing what they love"
You know, this is what makes a great career person also.
I have an insane, fanatical devotion to all things quality and make it my lifes devotion to install it in everyone.
Posted by: Quality Weenie at June 23, 2006 10:08 AM (XG7jZ)
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Blogging I would consider an obsession versus a talent, at least in my case!
As for the greats, your description is so true. It brought Mozart to mind immediately, the insane and fanatical part especially!
Posted by: Anna at June 23, 2006 12:21 PM (rZYE5)
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June 20, 2006
FREEDOM OF SPEECH VS. NOT KNOWING WHEN TO SHUT UP - UPDATED 6-22-06
Blogson Jeff of Ponytailed Conservative considers
the story of Brittney McComb, who - while giving her valedictorian speech at her graduation ceremony - had her microphone cut off because she repeatedly referenced her Christian beliefs.
Jeff thinks the school was wrong to cut her off.
I have to politely disagree.
She didn't get her mic cut off for mentioning God, she had it cut off for deviating from the speech which had been previously approved by the school board - as she had been warned beforehand would happen. She agreed to the rules, then broke her agreement. What other recourse did the school have?
I think the essential question here is - did the school have the right to edit her valedictorian speech in the first place? Well, they're paying for the mic, so I think they do, for this particular venue.
Brittney's still perfectly free to praise God on her blog, or in her church, or even on random street corners. Her right to free speech in general is not being threatened here. The democratically elected school board has been granted the authority by their electors to set guidelines on graduation speeches. Given the information in the article, I don't see anything to indicate that they've misused that authority.
And I *do* have to wonder about Brittney's choice to go ahead with the unedited version of her speech. Why did she feel the need to mention Jesus over and over again? Wouldn't a simple, humble, "and I'd like to thank God" have been sufficient?
Perhaps she should re-read Jesus' opinions on the habit of indulging in pious public acts for the purpose of impressing other men.
As for the secular issues involved, the solution when butting heads with a rule you don't like isn't to violate the rule, it's to either complain loudly enough to get the rule changed beforehand, or to find an alternative means to reach your goal WITHOUT violating the rule. She could have printed her original speech out and passed it around as a flyer. She could have posted it on the internet as an MP3. She could have discussed it with her peers, one-on-one.
As it was, her actions were disruptive and uncalled for. She behaved like an undisciplined, spoiled brat, throwing a tantrum because she HAD to have HER way, right NOW.
Hopefully, as she matures, she'll discover that going over, under, or around are sometimes better methods of getting past a brick wall than trying to bulldoze through.
UPDATE 6-22-06: That 1 Guy of Drunken Wisdom provided a link to a story that fills in a LOT of the missing details about the content of the speech (original vs. edited) and some legal reasons why the decision was made as it was.
Posted by: Harvey at
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Substantively, Harvey, I agree. A larger question is: Is the school legally able to violate her constitutional right to freedom to exercise her religion? "Separation of church & state" obviously doesn't enter into it, as it is nowhere in the Constitution. However, may one voluntarily agree to the curtailment of one's constitutional rights?
As former sailors, I guess you and I both know the answer to the last question.
Posted by: Tennessee Budd at June 20, 2006 07:06 AM (wXSVh)
2
TB - I think you're right that this probably falls under "voluntary curtailment", assuming the laws in her state allow her to refuse to attend public school at her age.
If her attendance was state-mandated, then the "voluntary" aspect gets a little more questionable.
By the way, although the phrase "Separation of church & state" isn't in the Constitution verbatim, I believe that it's generally accepted as a short way of referencing the part of the First Amendment that says, "Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof". It's not a legal principle, it's just quicker to write.
By the way, is "establishment" in this context a verb or a noun?
Posted by: Harvey at June 20, 2006 07:25 AM (L7a63)
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Harvey, establishment is a verb. It goes back to the reign of Henry VIII when he established the Church of England to get around the Pope's refusal to grant his divorce. (Everyone in England was forced to change religions and the monestaries and nunneries were sacked for ol' Henry's purse.)
Our forefathers did not want the new government to have the ability to do the same, so the first amendment not only prohibited the establishment of a religion, it also made sure the government couldn't interfere in a person's right to exercise their chosen religion.
Personally, had the school not required prior approval, she should have been able to say what she wanted. Usually the school only prohibits profanity or inciteful speech and it's a sad day that being thankful for God's blessings is considered inciteful speech.
Posted by: Anna at June 20, 2006 08:41 AM (rZYE5)
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Anna - "verb" does seem to be the general consensus that I've found by Googling, but it's hard to find a serious legal discussion of the matter.
I agree that a simple bit of thankfulness to God is hardly inciteful. However, the article seems to indicate that her thankfulness was included so often in the speech as to make it seem inappropriate for a secular occasion, i.e. graduating from a public (not parochial) school.
Barring the release of the original version of her speech, it's hard to judge, though.
Posted by: Harvey at June 20, 2006 10:03 AM (L7a63)
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The democratically elected school board has been granted the authority by their electors to set guidelines on graduation speeches.
Bullshit. Utter, contemptible bullshit.
The United States Constitution SPECIFICALLY forbids placing restrictions on the free expression of ANY religion. Including Christianity.
The school board had no right to edit her speech. Period. Just because the majority of the school board are atheists does NOT mean they can impose THEIR religion on the Christians.
Do some fucking research into the ACTUAL US Constitution sometime. Like, how about using original documentation of what the writers, such as John Jay, said about what the Constition meant. It will burst your atheist bubble. Sorry. Just because a majority of idiots in black robes decided that "will not prohibit the free expression thereof" was trumped by "make no law RESPECTING a religion", and added a few more clauses that aren't actually there, doesn't make it correct.
The ONLY thing you need to know about the Supreme Court is that they're not.
Posted by: the Humble Devildog at June 20, 2006 01:39 PM (TIYju)
6
Schools have never been a democracy. They have always been a dictatorship. They set the rules, you follow or move on. Period. This is no exception. This rule is in place in our schools as well... valedictory speeches get pre approved. You deviate from what you submitted, *snip* mic is cut off.
She knew the consequences. She gambled. She lost. End of story.
Posted by: Bou at June 20, 2006 05:56 PM (iHxT3)
7
Happy Blogiversary! And - Yes - you're probably right!
Posted by: chrys at June 21, 2006 01:19 AM (Wdgi/)
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BlogDad, I have to admit -- you've got me reconsidering my position now...
Posted by: PC Jeff at June 21, 2006 03:29 AM (NYw9n)
9
And -- BTW -- I'm delighted to have stirred up such intelligent and stimulating debate!
Posted by: PC Jeff at June 21, 2006 03:33 AM (NYw9n)
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Intelligent except for Bou, that is...
She reminds me of an ex-wife of mine: high IQ and the common sense the a box of rocks have.
Posted by: PC Jeff at June 21, 2006 05:11 AM (NYw9n)
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Jeff - That last comment was gratuitous & uncalled for. Please stay on topic.
Anyway, the point is that free speech is NOT an "always and everywhere" kind of thing. You have it on your own property. You have it on public property. When you're on someone else's property, it's their rules.
Public schools make this a little dicier in principle, since they're both "public property" and "someone else's property" at the same time. However, from a legal standpoint, when the government runs something, they generally compromise by checking for "due process" and "equal treatment" when there's a question of fairness.
In this case, it sounds like Brittney had her "due process". Her speech was reviewed (just like everyone else's), it was edited, her and her father appealed the editing decision, and the board didn't change its mind on appeal. They didn't say "we refuse to listen to you because you're a Christian", they said "we still don't think your speech is appropriate for this venue. Accept the changes or don't give the speech at the graduation ceremony that will be held on school property".
They gave her her "day in court". She lost.
If you want to make the case that she didn't receive "equal treatment" because she was a Christian, you'll have to find evidence to prove your assertion, otherwise it's just a baseless accusation of "religious bias". Which I find uncomfortably similar to the way accusations of "racism" get hurled when minorities don't have proportional representation in a given profession, regardless of whether there are non-racist reasons why this may be so.
Now personally, I don't think government should be in the schooling business at all, but - since it is - I'm examining it from a "law as it exists" standpoint, using what I remember from my one miserable year of law school. I didn't graduate, so take it for what it's worth.
Posted by: Harvey at June 21, 2006 06:21 AM (L7a63)
12
Don't sweat it, Harvey. Some people never change. It is what it is.
Posted by: Bou at June 21, 2006 06:58 AM (iHxT3)
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I have given commencement speeches for 6th & 12th (private) grades, and for grad school (public university). Every school had speech guidelines and codes of behavior.
The one thing that has stayed with me is that commencement speeches not about the individual but rather are meant to reflect the collective educational experience as seen through an individual's eyes. It's not about "thanking" a person, thing or entity. It's about summarizing an experience and using it as a springboard to look at the future while at the threshold of change.
I think where this girl went wrong is believing the speech was to be about her. That's not only a bad speech, it was selfish and unchristian (& I'm a christian). Of course she tried to personalize it, but the truth of the matter is her speech obviously lacked substance and was mired in egotism and repetitiveness.
A better speech might have been one in which she posed the question: What were you most thankful for during your educational experience, why and how can those present continue to improve and contribute to society and future generations.
What aspects of your education will have a longlasting effect into your adulthood.
Those were the last 2 topics I covered at comencement.
My only wish is that more people either would receive guidance or would get cut off at commencement speeches.
Blog pappy, I agree with you. you're points were very much on target.
Posted by: Michele at June 21, 2006 11:14 AM (FJ2Bh)
14
Sounds like the school edited the speech, and she went with her original... not her deviating from her submitted speech.
http://www.reviewjournal.com/lvrj_home/2006/Jun-17-Sat-2006/news/8014416.html
Posted by: That 1 Guy at June 22, 2006 09:31 AM (gMMvi)
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If you look at the first amendment the school board was wrong for doing that They Violated her righst to free speech By her saying that dooes not mean the school endorses it. If next year someone gets up there and they let a valedictorian bash the government which is also free speech then they have serous issues she was thanking god and cited a few versus
WWW.firtsamendment.org is the website i believ
Posted by: doug at June 27, 2006 11:48 PM (flB4T)
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Brittany said what she wanted to say in her speech. By the way... it is HER speech,not the school board ( who by the way sound like a bunch of jerks) and so do you man get over yourself. Yall are the ones who need to get over yourselves and let people say what they want to say in there speeches as long as it isn't hurting anyone. Please tell me how is Brittany telling people about her beliefs hurting anyway... Maybe people dont want to hear the truth. People dont want to hear about Jesus and doing right when they know they are doing wrong.. it's true even Christians. But anyway back to the point Brittany should of been able to say what she wanted to say... Way to go Brittany!
Posted by: Rachel at August 12, 2006 08:12 PM (a6kuN)
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No, Brittany's speech didn't HURT anybody, but "hurting" isn't the standard. The standard is whether the speech represents a government-sponsored promotion of religion. According to previous rulings by the 9th Circuit Court, it would have. That's why it wasn't allowed:
http://www.reviewjournal.com/lvrj_home/2006/Jun-17-Sat-2006/news/8014416.html
You may not agree with those rulings, but they represent the law in America as it currently stands.
Personally, my problem with Brittany wasn't the content of her speech, it was her behavior. The school board told her that her speech in its original form wasn't acceptable, and told her that if she wanted to give her speech, she'd have to give an edited version. She agreed to those terms in order to get her shot at the podium, then she broke her agreement by giving the unedited version of the speech.
She lied to get what she wanted, and that's indefensible. Especially for a Christian.
Posted by: Harvey at August 13, 2006 08:22 AM (L7a63)
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May 18, 2006
MAYBE IT'S BECAUSE I'M NOT A BITTER LITTLE MAN CONSUMED WITH ENVY
Democrats are complaining because the latest Bush tax cut will only provide an average of $20 to Joe-six-packs like me, but $42,000 to those making $1 million plus.
the American people are beginning to understand that when they talk about tax cuts, they're not talking about helping middle-class people. They're talking about helping the wealthiest corporations and individuals among us," said Sen. Charles Schumer, D-N.Y.
Ya know something Schumer? F*ck you.
That's still 20 bucks more than I would've had if idiots like YOU were in charge, and my soul is not so black and shriveled that I can't be grateful for the small things I *do* get, even though I'd have been happier with more. For example:
My health club has a machine that rents movies for $1 a night. Now I'll be able to watch 20 more movies than I would've.
Or buy 3 more bags of my favorite Kenya AA coffee.
Or take my wife out to dinner at a Chinese buffet place, and still have enough change left over to buy her a bottle of that White Zinfandel wine she likes.
True, these are only small pleasures, but they are pleasures nonetheless, and who the hell is Charles "6-figure-salary" Schumer to begrude ME these small pleasures simply because he hates people who make 7 figures?
What a tiny, wretched, bastard of a man.
$20 isn't nothing to me, Mr. Schumer.
But you are.
Posted by: Harvey at
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1
It so pisses me off when they complain that the little guy only gets $xx money, but the big guys get $xxxxx money.
Well you know what the big guys pay more in so of course the big guy is going to get more money back.
What pisses me off even further, some of the figures they throw out there about families making to much money include me.
Know what pisses me off even more that than, the fact that I have worked my ass off and my husband works his ass off so we can get where we are. We have spent alot of money to educate ourselves to get to the positions where we are at and now some jackass in the goberment tells me I am rich and make to much money and I should be giving me hard earned money to some dumb smuck on welfare. Well they can kiss my large, white, well educated, rich ass.
Posted by: Quality Weenie at May 18, 2006 07:52 AM (XG7jZ)
2
And he's always been that way and likely always will. Why the people of NY keep electing such a jealous, self-serving bastard, I'll never know.
Posted by: Ogre at May 18, 2006 07:57 AM (/k+l4)
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Well said, Harvey. I'm thinking that $20 will buy me plenty of enjoyment of a nice case of beer. Or just a case of Bud Light. Either way.
Posted by: spurringirl at May 18, 2006 08:47 AM (+/Nxs)
4
Hear Hear...or here here, I forget which one is correct, but either way, I gotta go with QW in thinking if rich people have more money, don't a bunch of them SPEND more too?? I know some of them are rich 'cause they save money, but wouldn't the ones who spend be helping our economy. In fact wouldn't the best way to get money from rich people(or from ALL people for that matter) would be to just apply a SALES tax to everything? Income tax doesn't get everybody, because not EVERYbody works...BUT everybody buys stuff.
I don't know...maybe that's too simple.
Oh well.
PS Dean Cain is HOT!!
Posted by: shimauma at May 18, 2006 11:05 AM (oH+XM)
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A - freekin' - Men. I'll be happy with my $20 too.
Posted by: Richmond at May 18, 2006 12:09 PM (e8QFP)
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Shimauma: When rich people save money, they invest it, which helps provide jobs, goods, and services--that's the theory, anyway.
Harvey: I always calculate these sums of money in terms of pizza. $10 is enough for one large pizza, $20 for two, and even a couple of bucks would buy a slice, enough for lunch for one.
Posted by: Miriam at May 19, 2006 09:40 AM (6Ri1P)
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Are you for real here? OK, let me put it simpler... the 42k comes out of a budget that's already IN deficit... So that's coming out of YOUR taxes (the tax burden is disproportionately held by those under 100k)
So no, you didn't make $20, you lost numerous little services that probably saved you more than $20.
--Phil
Posted by: Phil Julius at May 22, 2006 02:35 PM (iiq5I)
8
Phil - Respectfully disagree about the tax burden:
http://www.allegromedia.com/sugi/taxes/
Also, I'm not familiar with any instances of the gov't ever actually cutting a service.
Posted by: Harvey at May 22, 2006 02:55 PM (L7a63)
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May 14, 2006
NO, REALLY, IT'S *JUST* A COMMERCIAL
(cross-posted from
IMAO)
Via Right Wing Nation, I found an offended feminist complaining about this Carl's Jr. commercial wherein Dr. 90210 recommends breast augmentation... the punchline being that he's talking to a chicken, and chicken sandwiches are what's being advertised. But yon offended feminist claims that it's not "just a commercial"
It's not "just" anything. It's an ideological piece of propaganda designed to justify two things: the annihilation of chicken's lives and the annihilation of the human female's self esteem.
Gotta disagree.
Here's what the commercial is designed to do:
Sell chicken sandwiches.
But what the hell does a cosmetic surgeon have to do with food?
Here's the deal - prior to about 1950 or so, advertisements took the direct approach. They told people why a product was good and asked them to buy it. Maybe they threw in a jingle to help folks remember the product's name.
But somewhere in the early 50's, marketing researchers discovered that listing the features and asking for the sale wasn't necessary. Just the jingle. Because people don't choose which products to buy for logical reasons, they buy them for emotional ones, and make up the logical ones afterwards to justify it.
Ultimately resulting in marketers designing ad campaigns that went straight for the emotions.
The way they do this is to spend the bulk of the commercial using sensory stimuli designed to put you into a particular emotional state - usually a positive one - and then telling you what they want you to buy in the hopes that the product will become associated in your mind with the positive state.
Does this mean that every time you pass a Carl's Jr., you'll slam on the brakes and zombie-shuffle into the store to buy a chicken sandwich?
No.
But if you're hungry and you're driving around and you see a Carl's Jr. sign, when you ask yourself "should I stop here?", a quick mental Googling of your inner database will turn up a response of "I've heard of Carl's Jr. and my general feelings toward it are more or less positive".
You may stop at Carl's Jr., you may not. But the commercial upped the odds somewhat.
But why would Carl's Jr. advocate murdering chickens and demeaning women in an attempt to make people feel good?
They. Didn't.
It was a joke. It was funny. Here's why:
In order for something to be funny, it needs both truth and exaggeration. If it's only exaggeration, it's just a lie. If it has only truth, it's a physics textbook. You need both.
However, if you don't have any truth handy, a popularly accepted stereotype will work almost as well, since a stereotype is something that's true for a significant portion - but not all - of a given group of people.
In this case, the stereotype is that women are insecure about their physical appearance, and some will seek to correct that through breast augmentation. The exaggeration is that this would apply to a chicken.
Throw in a pun on the word "breast" and you have humor. Which is designed to make you laugh so that you feel good so that you'll associate Carl's Jr. with that good feeling and stop into one of their restaurants to spend your money which they'll spend on more funny commercials.
Thus completing the Circle of Corporate Life.
The next logical "offended feminist" question is, "But doesn't it say something about the corporation that they chose to joke about women's breasts instead of, say, professional football, like in those nice Creepy-the-King burger commercials?"
Probably not. It's more likely that it's just what came off the top of the ad agency's head that morning.
As a self-described humor writer, I know how the creative process works, and it's something like this: you pick a topic, you free-associate some facts & stereotypes, and when you find one that takes you off on an unexpected tangent, you make a punch line out of it.
In this case, Mr. Ad Man had to make a chicken joke; thought about feathers, beaks, eggs, farms, and roosters before the idea of breasts; then - knowing "sex sells" - connected it to human female breasts, and eventually decided to use breast augmentation surgery as the segue between the two.
A joke was made, people laughed, a commercial was produced, and chicken sandwiches were sold by the ton.
Except to offended feminists, who will never go to Carl's Jr. ever again, on the assinine assumption that Mr. Ad Man's first thought was "How can I demean women today?" and not "How can I make a joke about chicken?"
But that's how it goes with humor. When you use stereotypes instead of truth, the joke will fail for the people to whom the stereotype does not apply. One man's funny is another feminist's annihilation propaganda. So when you write, the best you can do is aim for the bulk of your target audience, ignore the offended, and hope that next time you have to write a joke, the truth or stereotype you base your humor on is more universal.
Now if you'll excuse me, I'm going to go assuage my hunger with a Carl's Jr. chicken breast sandwich.
Heh. I said "breast"
*snicker*
Posted by: Harvey at
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So if I thought it was funny does that mean I'm *not* a femminist??
...
...
...
Well thank heavens.
Posted by: Richmond at May 14, 2006 01:40 PM (e8QFP)
2
Why didn't they mention the fried zucchini?
Posted by: shimauma at May 14, 2006 03:54 PM (YKu7i)
3
Like she's ever going in a Carl's Jr.
Girl, just because you don't want to patronize a business doesn't mean you have the right to say I can't patronize that business.
Posted by: Alan Kellogg at May 14, 2006 06:22 PM (VdfnG)
4
I think your article got the most spams EVER Harv.
Do I still have to sit in time out for like big juicy breasts and hamhocks?
Posted by: shimauma at May 15, 2006 06:48 AM (oH+XM)
5
Shimauma - Stop saying "juicy breasts"... it's VERY distracting! :-)
Meanwhile I deleted all those spams. In case anyone's wondering, there were about 20 of 'em. Mostly for cheap prescription drugs.
Posted by: Harvey at May 15, 2006 09:12 AM (L7a63)
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Note to Harv's wife...Talk about sandwiches; apparently they get him excited.
And don't forget the big juicy...HAMHOCKS!!
Posted by: shimauma at May 15, 2006 10:47 AM (oH+XM)
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I think the spams were from the title. I've been trying to analyze what brings the spammers out in force and in the last two weeks, certain words in post titles are bringing them out: "Ads," and "Links" are big for me, so I'm betting "commercial" did it for you.
Posted by: Ogre at May 15, 2006 11:33 AM (/k+l4)
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I was SO going to give them my business exactly because it was about bigger titties and dead chickens...
Now I'm crushed.
Thanks for nothing, Harv!
Posted by: Graumagus at May 15, 2006 11:43 AM (iwJET)
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Google your inner database...
What the fuck????
You jack-off idiot!
Posted by: Madfish Willie at May 15, 2006 07:44 PM (UyJtB)
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MW - congrats on guessing what "google your inner database" is a euphemism for :-P
Posted by: Harvey at May 15, 2006 10:02 PM (L7a63)
11
Since we don't have a Carl's Jr ... I'm going to Hardee's for supper tonight!
Posted by: basil at May 16, 2006 08:40 AM (4Ek1C)
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April 15, 2006
HOW LONG SHOULD YOU KISS THE BRIDE?
I've been to a few weddings in the last couple of years, and I've always found myself raising an eyebrow at the "kiss the bride" segment, because the kisses were short, perfunctory, and absent of all but the most token passion.
By contrast, during my own wedding ceremony, the nuptual buss was long, deep, and enthusiastic. When it was finally finished, the minister's first words were "you may now STOP kissing the bride" (seriously, we've got it on tape).
So, how was YOUR wedding kiss?
If it was short, was it just because you were nervous, or maybe just intimidated by the throng of witnesses?
Also, do you think there's any correlation between the enthusiasm of the wedding kiss and the longevity of the ensuing marriage?
Posted by: Harvey at
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I don't know about the correlation thing, I think we did that later that evenin', but, after 17 years, I'm still kissin' her... ass.
Posted by: RedNeck at April 15, 2006 05:48 PM (tSJ8V)
2
Never had the fortune to have my own wedding... but at one of my brother's wedding, we had a fire-extinguisher hidden behind the pulpit in case the kiss went on too long. Unfortunately, we didn't need to use it.
Posted by: GEBIV at April 15, 2006 09:03 PM (dmjxv)
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My fiance and I practiced our 'you may kiss the bride kiss' before the wedding. We both agreed that in front of a church full of family with the minister looking on was no place for some hot tongue action. Our kiss was on the lips for... 1, 2, 3 and release!
You have the rest of your life to swap tongues with your spouse. Show some class and don't do it in church.
Posted by: Barry at April 16, 2006 12:41 AM (kKjaJ)
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There was tongue involved!
Posted by: Quality Weenie at April 16, 2006 10:51 AM (BksWB)
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I barely remember - but I think it was short and of the "let's do this quick and get the hell out of here variety". My husband and I hated our wedding. The families (on both sides) made the whole thing a nightmare. So, while I am very happy to be married to him - I just cringe whenever I look back at that day. We don't even look at the pictures if we can help it.
I figure that day has been the low point of our marriage - that means it's gotten better every year since then. *grin*
Posted by: Teresa at April 16, 2006 12:07 PM (FZwDL)
6
I had a very large and formal wedding. A long kiss with tongue action would have brought on some serious frowns from both sides of the family, I feel certain. But I'm not into overt public displays of affection like that in general, so it was never something that was considered. It was more of a romantic gentle, lingering kiss... not quite 1,2,3, but not passionate where I'd want to avert my eyes from the TWO priests that were conducting our ceremony.
Posted by: Bou at April 16, 2006 09:18 PM (iHxT3)
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I think our kiss was short because we were nervous, plus the minister had us holding both hands, so leaning forward over our own hands was awkward and we were both too spooked to let go for a good EMBRACE. We had to make up for it later.
Posted by: shimauma at April 17, 2006 06:54 AM (oH+XM)
8
We had a good kiss. Not too short but not eliciting any frowns either. I was just relieved to be married...
Posted by: Richmond at April 17, 2006 10:51 AM (e8QFP)
9
We just re-watched our wedding video for Valentine's Day this year (approaching our 5th anniversary in a little more than a month)... Our kiss was relatively short, but there was definitely tongue involved. I noticed it when I watched the video - it didn't occur to me at the time how obvious it would be or we might have tried to be more discreet I suppose.
Posted by: songstress7 at April 18, 2006 12:59 AM (0zDjn)
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Kiss? What? You are supposed to KISS after the ceremony?
I knew I forgot something....
Oh yeah, the ceremony!
Posted by: Rave at April 18, 2006 08:20 AM (Fir0Z)
11
That hot and heavy stuff is what the wedding NIGHT is for, I'd say.
Posted by: Ogre at April 18, 2006 09:10 AM (/k+l4)
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Ogre - yeah, but it's never too early for warm-ups :-)
Posted by: Harvey at April 18, 2006 10:21 AM (L7a63)
13
I think our kiss was just long enough. We're not big on PDA. I don't recall being nervous (because I slammed an airplane-size bottle of vodka/empty tummy). We got married on Halloween. I was the traditional bride, but hubby wore a real straight jacket and a plastic ball n chain. Best man was the grim reaper (because we all know marriage = death!). Most guests, as requested, came in costume. Nothing traditional about our wedding other than my gown. Even the tier cake was halloween themed!
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Posted by: at May 08, 2006 11:28 AM (PWy7L)
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I went back for seconds.
Posted by: GaMongrel at May 18, 2006 06:52 PM (tYXgL)
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March 22, 2006
MEN IN A NUTSHELL
Richmond of One For the Road says that to understand men, all you need to do is understand
the 7 questions that drive their lives:
1. Am I hungry?
2. Am I horny?
3. Do I have to pee?
4. Is the game on?
5. Will this get me laid?
6. Am I sleepy?
7. Will this make me money?
Can't really argue with this list. And the number 8 for married guys rounds it out exquisitely:
8. Is my wife gonna yell at me if I.....?
However, I think she may be slightly off on answering this particular question:
"Why don't men see things that need to be picked up?"
The truth is, every person - men AND women - have a certain tolerance for chaos & disorder in their living environment. A certain amount of "scattered objects and dust-bunnies" above which the irresistable desire to restore order kicks in. And the level is different for everyone.
So, in ANY given couple, someone will crack under the stress of needing to clean before the other person. Usually it's the woman.
However, when I got married, Beloved Wife had a higher tolerance for chaos than I did, and I could never figure out how SHE could manage to "not see things that needed to be picked up".
Which left me with three courses of action:
1) Change her
2) Clean up after her
3) Adopt her level of chaos tolerance
I chose option 3, and we've lived happily ever after, even if there ARE a few things that need putting away.
How YOU folks choose to solve the "chaos gap", I leave to your own discretion.
Posted by: Harvey at
03:33 PM
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1
Our choas gap is huge
I'm a neat freak.
My BetterHalf however is a self admitted slob.
I absolutely positively refuse to go to option 3.
Especially not with 2 kids.
So about once a week I actually get to snap the whip a bit and get her to help me out.
The rest of the week I assume the household cleaning duties. All I ask of her in that time is fold the laundry and empty the dishwasher. I'll do everything else
Posted by: BloodSpite at March 22, 2006 05:12 PM (ZTGJT)
2
And I like Bloodspite have come to terms with the the fact that "nobody cares but me" anyway... Crack the whip? Yes I do, occasionally.
I definitely wish others cared too though, sometimes....
Posted by: Richmond at March 22, 2006 08:47 PM (e8QFP)
3
And those who remain happily married almost never choose option #1...
Congrats on recognizing this, Harv, as it's a key to a happy relationship.
Posted by: Ogre at March 23, 2006 06:22 AM (/k+l4)
4
Heh, yeah Ogre, like many women can be changed in a marriage anyway.
That's like teaching a cat how to fetch.
Posted by: silentwarrior at March 23, 2006 07:22 AM (x2iVE)
5
My husband and I have different tolerances for chaos in different areas. If something is bugging me then I clean it up. If something is bugging him then he cleans it up. Seems to have worked so far. *grin*
Posted by: Teresa at March 23, 2006 10:35 AM (FZwDL)
6
Man, that's what I did wrong! *Takes notes* I'll have to try this if I ever find myself in that situation again.
Posted by: Sticks at March 23, 2006 05:03 PM (tC2QQ)
7
Harv, you are the gayest straight boy I know.
I wish I could honestly say I didn't understand what you mean, but as my SO has a significantly greater chaos tolerance than I , I do know exactly know what you mean. I just lowered my tolerance. Count on you to take the high road.
Posted by: og at March 23, 2006 05:04 PM (N95T8)
8
And I mean that in the nicest possible way.
Posted by: og at March 23, 2006 05:05 PM (N95T8)
9
I'm married to Monk, as in the character from the TV show. And I have clutter issues. I'm not slovenly by any stretch, but I'm not a neat freak either. He has adapted to me, trying to be OK with the chaos that can be my life and I know what really pushes his buttons and try to make sure I don't bug the ever living crap out of him.
We can't change each other, but we've met somewhere in the middle. And when he finally gets all OCD on me, I just stay out of his way and know he'll work through it.
Posted by: Bou at March 23, 2006 07:59 PM (iHxT3)
10
Og - Hey! I'm NOT gay!
Although I *do* love the feel of TNT's muscular arms holding me close.
Oh, and show tunes. LOVE those show tunes! :-)
Posted by: Harvey at March 24, 2006 07:21 AM (L7a63)
11
Harvey's Gay! Harvey's Gay!
But hey, you can't be fired from any job now...
Posted by: Ogre at March 24, 2006 09:15 AM (/k+l4)
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March 16, 2006
WIFELY REMINDERS
Bloggranddaughter ArmyWifeToddlerMom
made mention of this in her meme answer:
~7)Least favorite thing about your significant other.
~he procrastinates, and is irritated with my "reminders".
9) Your significant other's least favorite thing about you
(again, without asking them).
~"reminding" him he has procrastinated.
Meanwhile, Bloggranddaughter Lee Ann of Lee Ann's View is getting called "mother" for passing out "reminders"
Which got me thinking... Beloved Wife TNT of Smiling Dynamite does NOT nag.
She does, however, "remind".
And pretty much every time she does, I find myself getting irritated.
And I have no idea why.
It's not like she's hitting me with a rolling pin at the time, or speaking in some gawdawful Gladys Kravitz voice, so it shouldn't cause me any discomfort.
To my own credit, I don't snap back at her, and I reply with an acquiessive "Yes, dear", because I *know* my reaction is inappropriate and needs to be squelched. Yet I always rankle a little at queries about my to-do list, as if she were questioning my competence to function as an adult.
Which she's not, so it makes no sense for me to react as if she were.
I'm puzzled about this, and so I ask - is there a way for a wife to give "reminders" that ISN'T irritating, or is this just a permanent skirmish in the battle of the sexes?
Posted by: Harvey at
06:34 AM
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1
There will NEVER be a way for women/wife/other to give reminders where the man doesn't get irritated. And if there is, I WANNA KNOW TOO!
I remind Hubby by email. We share a calendar in Outlook, so I put in reminders and email them to him in the next room. It automatically goes onto his calendar.
He doesn't have to say 'yes, dear' or hide irritation at me, I get to remind him without the irritation.
For us, it's a win/win situation.
Posted by: Rave at March 16, 2006 07:04 AM (Fir0Z)
2
reminders with kisses or other sexual favors? No wait, that would only continue the need to be reminded . . . I'm fresh out!
Posted by: oddybobo at March 16, 2006 07:56 AM (6Gm0j)
3
Damn, this is an unexpected side of you, Harv.
Posted by: og at March 16, 2006 07:59 AM (N95T8)
4
Do you remind her of things she needs to do?
But, smart-ass question aside, the correct solution is to be proactive. You should provide her with an update as to the status of the items on your to-do list before she asks.
Or, if she asks, provide a status then.
In the first case - being proactive - you have eliminated the question and satiated the curiosity of "have you forgotten about this?"
In the second - rather than answering "yes dear", but provide a status (e.g. "That store was packed with people so I'll stop there tomorrow at a different time.") - You have satisfied the curiosity as well, just after the fact.
...
Three follow-up comments:
-- AdVice is one of the worst vices there is.
-- Free advice is worth every penny.
-- Taking relationship advice from a person who isn't married may not be worth the penny you paid.
Posted by: _Jon at March 16, 2006 08:03 AM (uHRYR)
5
*hey, when DH got home from work last night I asked him "the question"...
I got his favorite thing wrong....HA
although I won't make mention of it...
least favorite, he is well trained and did not answer
Posted by: armywifetoddlermom at March 16, 2006 08:12 AM (rGu1V)
6
the good news is "I got DH favorite thing about me wrong
*wink*
DH well trained enought not to answer least favorite.
Posted by: armywifetoddlermom at March 16, 2006 08:15 AM (rGu1V)
7
_Jon - yes, I do remind her sometimes, but she just takes it as me showing interest in her activities and showing that I care, which - I assume - is a typical female reaction, and the reason why women are puzzled by men's grumpy reactions to "reminders".
Posted by: Harvey at March 16, 2006 09:11 AM (ubhj8)
8
Nope. It will always bother you when you're reminded. Why? Because it reminds you that you failed.
Seriously. If you did what you knew you were supposed to do, there'd be no need for a reminder. You DIDN'T do it, so you're being reminded -- and at the same time, quite often unintentionally, told that you failed.
If you didn't get annoyed, I'd worry.
Posted by: Ogre at March 16, 2006 09:25 AM (/k+l4)
9
Heh - the problem isn't that I failed, the problem is that SHE NOTICED that I failed :-D
Posted by: Harvey at March 16, 2006 09:30 AM (ubhj8)
10
I will every once in awhile ask him if he's did something that I know he has already done and then when he says yes I make a big deal out of it with lots of praise. So it makes the "nagging" about doing things that haven't been done a little less "nagging".
Positive reinforement is the answer to almost everything.
Posted by: Machelle at March 16, 2006 10:25 AM (ZAyoW)
11
Hmmm, that reminds me,,,,
The new permenent heating and air conditioner filters that I bought are just about ripe and ready to be cut to size and installed. I'd better get to it before Linda Lou beminds me.
Posted by: Peter at March 16, 2006 11:14 AM (BaUHe)
12
Usually when I get "reminded", it sends a cringe right through me. Two reasons. One, Damnit, I forgot somethin'. Two, Damnit, she didn't.
Rarely does it work the "other way 'round", and if it does, it's your fault she forgot. Trust me on that last one...
Posted by: RedNeck at March 16, 2006 06:15 PM (tSJ8V)
13
Unless its something really really important, I don't remind. I try not to give him a 'to do' list at all. If something needs to be done, I just do it.
I will 'remind' him for real about a commitment, but I don't think that's what you're getting at. I'll say, "Remember, the boys have ball practice tonight..."
Posted by: Bou at March 16, 2006 06:52 PM (iHxT3)
14
I've learned to ignore the reminders.
Posted by: Contagion at March 16, 2006 08:28 PM (e8b4J)
15
Why does this sound like women training their dogs?
'Fetch!' 'Good Boy!' 'You get a bone!'
And why is it that women remember these things, men don't? I think I'll have to blog about that...
Posted by: Rave at March 17, 2006 07:27 AM (Fir0Z)
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March 03, 2006
GUYS, I NEED A LITTLE HELP WITH THIS ONE
Bloggranddaughter Rave of Quic Nunc
asks this question:
[My 15-year old son] has decided that it's fun to sneak out of the house at midnight.....
[snip]
Now, he did not have glassy eyes or smell of weed, which is good. But it doesn't clear him, by any means.
[snip]
WHY does he do this? I am not a 15 yr old male. I don't know what's going through his head.
Short answer - because it's fun.
As a former 15 yr old male, I confess that I occasionally snuck out after midnight. Sometimes not even for criminal purposes.
If I remember correctly, it had to do with the solitude. I knew the whole world was asleep, and no one was going to see me walking around. I lived in a small town that rolled up the sidewalks at 9pm, so this might not be applicable to Rave's case.
Traipsing about in the wee hours, there's nothing but you, your thoughts, and a sky filled with stars. No people, no distractions. It was a good time to contemplate who I was and what was going on in my life without worrying about being interrupted by an inquisitive parent.
Plus the added thrill of doing something forbidden.
As for what to do about it... I have no advice. I think it's just one of those "straining against the leash" phases. All I can say is that if you don't hold the line on this, he'll just find another boundary to test. Make a fuss about it to his face, but inwardly, be relieved that it's just a growing pain.
If any other former 15 yr old males have more insight, please share.
Posted by: Harvey at
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1
I skipped those years, myself. But I'll weigh in with the "thrill of doing something forbidden" -- that's a BIG reason for doing SO many things for the adolecent male.
Posted by: Ogre at March 03, 2006 10:26 AM (/k+l4)
2
I will agree with Harvey on this one. My son and his friend used to do this.
(A little background: Once we moved from our house where he grew up - he stuck stubbornly to his friends in the old neighborhood - so nearly every weekend his friend was at our house or he was down there.)
Anyhow - It drove me straight up the wall. For one thing they would leave the doors unlocked all night... so I always knew. I told them they were going to get picked up for breaking curfew and I would let them sit in jail and rot. I told his friend's mom what they were doing and she tried to drill it into their heads too...
The big thing I pulled out was - if anything was going down in the neighborhood and they were picked up outside at that time of night - they were going to catch the blame - whether or not they had done anything. (note big eye rolls by both boys)
Yeah, stand your ground - as Harvey says - if you let this go - they'll try something bigger and better. Testing the limits is a teen thing. You don't want all out war - but they have to know when they've hit a boundary.
Also, I could pull the plug on him having his friend over for the weekend or letting him go anywhere. Teens will make anyone stark staring mad - they only make it through those years by sheer luck of this I am sure.
Posted by: Teresa at March 03, 2006 11:20 AM (FZwDL)
3
Get his ass up at 6am and don't let him take a nap.
By midnight he'll be passed out.
Oh, and no Dew or Bull after 6pm.
You can also try the "future privelages" negotiation:
- Explain that after he gets his driver's license, he's gonna want to borrow the car. If he gives up the sneaking out now, then borrowing the car next year is possible (assuming grades stay up). Don't threaten with "If you go out, you'll never be able to borrow the car." You'd be full of shit and he'll know it. Leave the threat unsaid.
If you don't have a car for him to borrow, substitute for something else. Like molesting the cat, I dunno.
Posted by: _Jon at March 03, 2006 12:50 PM (g9Y9+)
4
I have no advice. It's 2AM and I just uncovered the clothes piled on Daredevil's bed. I have no idea where my son is. He is 18 now, so whatever happens is on his shoulders. But, I hate sitting here scared to death waiting for the phone to ring.
Posted by: Sticks at March 04, 2006 01:09 AM (3cQ89)
5
Oh yeah, my friends and I used to do it all the time. We'd get up and sneak around the neighborhood. Mostly seeing how long before someone saw us and called the cops. Then it was a game to see if we could get back to the house and get inside before being caught. We never were.
And looking back I'm not sure why it was fun. I think the worse thing we ever did was toss tomatos at passing cars on a nearby road.
None of our parents really laid down the law on us, although I know at least some of them knew. I think they just realized it was just us being stupid and if we got arrested we knew it was our ass.
Posted by: Kevin at March 04, 2006 01:53 AM (Nmxi6)
6
I remember when one of my friends slept over back when I was about 15. We snuck out to run around the neighborhood with another kid, and when we got back, discovered that my dad had come home from working late after we had left, and locked the house up for the night. We had to ring the doorbell to get back in.
Posted by: Patriot Xeno at March 04, 2006 07:43 AM (z4SP5)
7
I lived in the middle of nowhere when I was 15. Of course I still live in the middle of nowhere, but now its because I hate people. Anyway, I never sneaked out after midnight. As far as why he is sneaking out, it could be he thinks he is tough enough to take on the world. Tell him, the doors will be locked by midnight and they will not unlock until you get up. If he wants to sneak out, he had better be prepared to stay out all night and be grounded for a couple of months when you do let him back in. He will probably rail against you for denying him what he wants. But, better he gets it into his head now that bad things happen when you sneak out without telling anyone than to sneak out and suddenly find himself on a milk carton.
Posted by: Deathknyte at March 05, 2006 01:04 AM (LJfQq)
8
LOL- you guys are too funny.
Locking the door after midnight didn't even occur to me! (I just wanted to take all his clothes out of his room...)
Thanks for the advice!
Posted by: Rave at March 05, 2006 08:41 AM (Fir0Z)
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February 27, 2006
IS IT THE BOTTOM OF THE BARREL, OR JUST THAT LAYER OF SLIMY STUFF THAT GROWS ON TOP OF IT?
Blogdaughter Boudicca of
Boudicca's Voice said
What has this blog come to that IÂ’m carpet blogging? I am sure it is truly the most pathetic blogging around...
Most people put cat-blogging at the bottom.
Which makes me wonder... what IS the "quality blogging" hierarchy?
I'll take a stab at it. From highest to lowest:
1) Original news - breaking a story before the MSM
2) Competing news - covering stories that the MSM is ignoring
3) Original opinion - finding an angle on a news story that no one else has
4) Helpful advice - posting a piece containing a solution to a problem
5) Essay blogging - sharing a common opinion, but doing so in uncommonly good style
6) Story blogging - well-written original fiction
7) Life blogging - well-written true-life stories
Original humor - just making stuff up to make people laugh
9) Forwarded humor - re-posting something funny you found elsewhere
10) Hey! Look at this! - linking something interesting you found elsewhere
11) Memes
12) Quizzes
13) 24
14) American Idol
15) Carpets
16) Kids/Cats/Dogs/Hamsters/Ferrets and other critters that mess up carpets
17) WTF! OMG! RU serious? - Live Journal teen angst diary-posting heavily laced with IM abbreviations and/or dark, introspective poems about how painful life is.
Which is not to say that any of these are - by definition - not interesting. I'm just talking about perceptions of status.
You may bicker & second-guess in the comments.
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1
Where does photo blogging rate?
Posted by: oddybobo at February 27, 2006 10:06 AM (6Gm0j)
2
American Idol - popular amongst Americans because it's a sure fire bet that an American will win. Winter Olympics - unpopular amongst Americans (and Brits) due to the Russians and Europeans winning everything. Hence AI trouncing Turin-a-thon in your ratings?
Posted by: Alex at February 27, 2006 10:50 AM (7vhJl)
3
Eh, well, I suck. All my blogging falls between #7 and 16... hamster blogging. But I happen to like some of my hamster blogging best as it usually involves some sort of chaotic mess that results in a pseudo funeral service with my handling a shovel in our pet cemetary. ;-)
Posted by: Bou at February 27, 2006 11:42 AM (iHxT3)
4
Nice list. I was feeling pretty good about myself (and averaging a 4) and even getting pretty smug about the fact that I've never mentioned either 24 or American Idol on the Yak until I hit #15 and 16 and realized that for a short time I blogged a few entries containing both the words "carpet" and "cat puke."
At least I've never let the "send" button go down on my angst. Then again, yaks aren't exactly known for suffering from angst.
Posted by: The Random Yak at February 27, 2006 12:07 PM (H4MUq)
5
.. wait.. where do I fit in?... oh, and you left out drunk-blogging...
Posted by: Eric at February 27, 2006 02:04 PM (r5XsL)
6
Hmmm. Wonder what this says about your spawn? Since a few of us fit close to the bottom (though not the very bottom). ;-)
Posted by: vw bug at February 27, 2006 03:16 PM (wEbEm)
7
Eric... is... an... ellisis... blogger....
Posted by: Madfish Willie at February 27, 2006 05:11 PM (D2pBz)
8
ELLIPSIS.... fucking dumbass retarded typing finger!
Posted by: Madfish Willie at February 27, 2006 05:13 PM (D2pBz)
9
... damn, Madfish....
Heidi Vodka..
Posted by: Eric at February 27, 2006 05:24 PM (r5XsL)
10
So how does cursing your own body parts rank on this list of blogging? *sidelong glace at Madfish Willie*
Posted by: ktreva at February 27, 2006 06:33 PM (e8b4J)
11
Ha! Gunblogging is at the very top of the list.
Click.
Posted by: Peter at February 27, 2006 06:49 PM (Ffvoi)
12
Well sh*t, I didn't even make it on the list. :-)
Posted by: MathCog Idiocy at February 27, 2006 08:46 PM (fF4La)
13
WTF? Y U h8? Life sucks, so Y not blog?
Posted by: Ogre at February 28, 2006 09:40 AM (/k+l4)
14
Crap blogging!!! Has to be in the top five
PS: Carpet is way more interesting than American Idol (except for the tryouts with all the really horrible people. That's some funny shit)
Posted by: Graumagus at February 28, 2006 01:34 PM (5u5N6)
15
Crap blogging kinda goes with "critters that mess up carpets"
Posted by: Harvey at February 28, 2006 02:55 PM (ubhj8)
16
American Idol needs to be moved up. I live to see who Simon makes cry each week.
Kids and dogs need to be removed from ANYTHING that has the word cat in it. It's just not right. Well, especially the dogs.
ROTFLOLPIMP!!! OMG at the Live Journal reference.
Posted by: Moogie at March 01, 2006 02:49 PM (wEYaf)
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February 23, 2006
WHITHER ACCENTS?
In the comments to this entry about
Hugh Laurie's marvelous American accent posted by Jim of Parkway Rest Stop, commenter
Sluggo chimes in:
Why do Americans sound so phoney when they try to put on an English accent, but the gotammed Brits can sound like they just rolled in from Lincoln, Nebraska whenever they want?
If I had to guess, I'd say that it's because the "accentless" cornbelt dialect is quite popular in movies & TV, and fairly consistent between speakers. If you can tell the difference between someone from Ohio, Indiana, Illinois, Iowa, and Nebraska, I'd be flabbergasted. So of the thousands of famous people who speak "Normal American", you can pick any one of them to emulate & pass yourself off as a Yank.
Famous British accents, however, are numerous and conflicting in style. If you're in-country and travel 20 miles down the road (or even across town in London), it's going to be noticably different. It's just harder for an American to pick one and find enough examples of it to master it properly. Who should I pick? Mick Jagger? Pierce Brosnan? Benny Hill? John Cleese? Tony Blair?
So my short answer is: because Hollywood is a district of Los Angeles, not London.
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Really? MJ has British family and they all do truly reprehensible American accents. We spent some time with them at Bro in laws wedding and they were shooting BB guns and trying to act like cowboys...
It wasn't pretty!
Posted by: Jake Jacobsen at February 23, 2006 02:55 PM (8rEm3)
2
Aren't you forgetting Madonna? Who can forget her wonderfully authentic British accent.
'Scuse me while I vomit.
Posted by: Raging Mom at February 23, 2006 03:19 PM (7L3I1)
3
I can pick out accents from Ohio, Indiana, Illinois, Iowa and Ontario.
It's easy if you actually live near these states.
Posted by: Machelle at February 23, 2006 03:29 PM (ZAyoW)
4
When I was in NY (briefly) I learned to distinguish a Lon Giland from a Brooklyn. It is a proximity thing.
Also, some people's brains pick up accents easier than others.
Also, accent-less speech (such as computer speech) is closest to west-coast US (including California), so maybe it's harder for someone who doesn't normally use the tools of accent (pacing, inflection, tonal quality, etc) to utilize them than for some who already does....
Posted by: caltechgirl at February 23, 2006 03:55 PM (/vgMZ)
5
So, after all this readin', somebody tell me, how do you say "Wanker" properly.
Posted by: RedNeck at February 23, 2006 04:59 PM (tSJ8V)
6
Redneck? It's pronounced "Michael Moore."
Posted by: Ogre at February 23, 2006 05:39 PM (2IrwV)
7
It might also be a factor that a central or south central accent is how rock and roll is done. Or was. Whether you grew up in Helsinki or Crumbly-on-Cheese you could do Mellencamp or Fogerty.
Posted by: Sluggo at February 23, 2006 06:30 PM (8WuIi)
8
I've also marvelled at Hugh's accent, being a fan of Blackadder as well as House. I thought maybe he'd lived in the US for a while or something, but then in the movie Flight of the Phoenix he was back to a strong British accent. Guess the guy is just a major talent. Mind you, I'd like to see him try an Aussie accent, it seems no one but us aussies can get that right. Still cringing from Meryl Streep's attempt in the Lindy Chamberlain movie ...
Posted by: Amanda at February 23, 2006 11:38 PM (L4Sch)
9
Rachel Griffiths, the Aussie who played Brenda in "Six Feet Under" did a great American accent as well. However, I prefer to view Hugh Lauire and Rachel Griffiths as losing their "foreign accents" to play these parts.
:-)
Posted by: Jim - PRS at February 24, 2006 03:55 AM (njBz/)
10
Wow.
I just thought it was because when Americans do a British accent, they try to make it as annoying as they percieve real British accents to be.
Or may that's just me; nudge, nudge, wink, wink, knowwhatImean...
Posted by: jimmyb at February 24, 2006 08:02 AM (lmeFW)
11
I don't think there are more accents in the UK than here in the US - it's just that they are all squished up into a tiny little space - if you squished up all the accents here into a space the size of the UK, then I think the accents would be much more noticable.
I can tell the difference in regional accents here - St. Louis, Chicago, Kansas City, Southern Missouri and Western Kansas all have distinct sounds and even words.
Posted by: beth at February 25, 2006 06:15 AM (9FPYz)
12
I've heard some awful American accents from British people and some great British accents from Americans. Most people on both sides of the Atlantic stink at doing the other accent, but a few are great. Mark Addy from "The Full Monty" does a great American accent on "Still Standing" too, by the way.
Posted by: MikeTheLibrarian at March 01, 2006 01:03 PM (ATcxA)
13
Thank you!
http://wevugnxt.com/eoba/pzaj.html | http://fytqpovb.com/vbmg/wvil.html
Posted by: Rex at May 04, 2006 11:13 PM (/BK4F)
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February 16, 2006
QUICK! BURN AN EMBASSY!
He's
making fun of Jesus!
Seriously, though, no Christian would be upset by this, because Christianity isn't about an image, or even Jesus. It's about an idea. The idea that Jesus embodied. The idea that a person can examine his life, discover his faults, repent his mistakes, and choose new behaviors at ANY point in time in order to live his life more in tune with his professed moral code.
Juvenile mockery bounces off that like a pebble off a stone wall.
I hope that Islam embraces a similar idea someday, so that it its adherants may join the ranks of the civilized world.
[Hat tip: Lynn of A Sweet, Familiar Dissonance]
Posted by: Harvey at
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1
I just burned a whole cigarette with Normal Bob Smith wrote on it. That's the best I could muster.
Posted by: Dr. Phat Tony at February 17, 2006 09:58 AM (fk/lm)
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February 15, 2006
IS IT *EVER* OK TO USE RACIAL SLURS? - UPDATED 2-16-06 9:30AM
Kevin of Eckernet is
a little pissed at Ann Coulter for using the term "raghead", citing this quote (I can't find a transcript - search "
ann coulter cpac" on Google News for more info):
"Maybe they do [have nuclear weapons], maybe they don't, but they're certainly acting like they do. ... If you don't want to get shot by the police, don't point a gun at them. Or as I think our motto should be, post 9/11," Coulter said, "'Raghead talks tough, raghead faces consequences.'"
I'm not sure I agree with him.
Now, I'm not usually a fan of racial slurs. Using them bespeaks a lack of imagination on the user's part. After all, there are SO many creative ways to be insulting, why settle for the easy target?
On the other hand, there may be times...
A thought experiment - if a black man murdered my wife, I wouldn't refer to him as "an African-American gentleman". I'd feel free to trot out a stream of the most hateful race-based epithets I could conjure, and I wouldn't feel bad about it.
I think in that case, it'd be ok, because it's personal between me & him. I don't mean to insult his race as a whole. I'm just trying to find the cruelest, most hurtful thing to throw at him, personally.
On the other hand, if I were to look at a black man looting stuff during Hurricane Katrina and I were to say something like "Ain't that just like a Negro to steal anything that ain't nailed down?", then that's NOT personal - that's just blanket bigotry. I'm insulting all black people in general.
Ann's case is somewhere in between. We're at war with a lot of Middle-Eastern Muslims. I'm a big fan of disrespecting my nation's enemies. Anything that pisses them off or makes their lives miserable is a GOOD thing in my book.
On the other hand, there are plenty of Middle-Eastern Muslims I would be proud to call "friend". Specifically, the ones who are working to help transform Iraq into a civilized nation in the face of a long, uphill struggle.
So if Ann were to say something like "I wish I could go to Iraq and personally shoot every last raghead I saw," then I'd say "Ann, you ignorant slut. Sit down and shut the f*ck up."
(Notice how "ignorant slut" is personal to Ann - I'm not insulting EVERY woman who's intellectually-challenged and vaginally-generous)
But upon examining her quote, she appears to be directing the "raghead" label only at Middle Eastern Muslims who actually threaten the security of American interests, rather than just haphazardly toward anyone who's wearing a turban. She's specifically aiming at terrorists, who - in general - suck. This isn't strictly personal, but I think it's nearer to that end of the spectrum than it is to bigotry.
So I'm leaning towards not having a problem with what she said.
Feel free to persuade me otherwise, if you're so inclined.
UPDATE 2-16-06 9:15 am: Perhaps the question should be, "is it simply wrong to insult a man based on ANY unchangeable physical characteristics?" For example, if my hypothetical murderer were bald, missing an eye, and had a club foot, would it be inappropriate for me to call him a "butchering, chrome-domed, popeyed, monopod"?
Not a rhetorical question. I'm honestly trying to examine where lines should be drawn on this issue. I know it's a sensitive topic, and I appreciate that so far the discussion has remained rational.
UPDATE 2-16-06 9:30 AM: Would calling him a "bastard" be considered a slur against people born out of wedlock? Would the appropriateness of the insult be affected by whether or not his parents were married when he was born, i.e. if he actually WERE a bastard?
Posted by: Harvey at
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1
vaginally generous. I like that term. Very Evocative.
:-D
Posted by: tommy at February 15, 2006 10:47 PM (EhwJT)
2
In the cases you cite, if your issue with the man himself or his race.
If it's with the man, deal with that. Independent of his race, his race should have nothing to do with it.
Even if the cases you cite justify what you that situation, Ann was not in a similiar situation. She's playing to a crowd. She's not trying to "hurt" any militant Muslims as she knows damn well they don't care what an infidel like her thinks or says.
Posted by: Kevin at February 15, 2006 11:03 PM (Nmxi6)
3
The only racial epithets I use are towards Arabs.
I've dealt with Muslim Arabs, in their home countries. Not much will make you hate them faster than that.
Posted by: the Humble Devildog at February 15, 2006 11:13 PM (TIYju)
4
I think the whole point is moot. Viva Feedom of Speech!
Posted by: Contagion at February 16, 2006 07:23 AM (Q5WxB)
5
She didn't use "raghead" she used "jihad monkey".
Her column is up on yahoo today.
Posted by: Machelle at February 16, 2006 07:48 AM (ZAyoW)
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Harvey, I see where you're coming from, but I still disagree. A couple of reasons:
1) I don't use the word n*gger, and haven't since I was old enough to understand what it meant. If a black man killed my wife, I'm certain that if he somehow managed to get to the police before I got my hands on him, I'd be begging the cops to "let me get my hands on that black cocksucker", but I wouldn't start hurling racial epithets.
2) Raghead is too inclusive. Think about the Sikhs. They wear turbans, but are pretty much peaceful people from what I've seen. Don't you think that raghead is offending to too many people? Think if Ann had used the term "sand n*gger" because, you know, they all look alike over in that part of the world. Still not offensive enough?
3) And here's the killer: those of us that don't sit on the left side of the political aisle have had to deal with the prevailing sentiment that we're all racist bastards. I always hear phrases like "You voted for Bush? You don't act like a racist/homophobe/bigot/::insert slur here::". What I don't need is a prominent conservative like Ann reinforcing that stereotype. And that's why I found her comments so egregious. It's not just that they made Ann look stupid, but they made everyone sitting right of center look bad.
If I ever meet her, I'll be sure to thank her.
Posted by: physics geek at February 16, 2006 08:19 AM (Xvrs7)
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Machelle - apparently she used "raghead" during her CPAC convention speech, but I did find the column you mentioned where she said "jihad monkey":
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ucac/20060216/cm_ucac/muslimbitesdog;_ylt=AlHqzAi3OriznQOXcp8tHj07vTYC;_ylu=X3oDMTBjMHVqMTQ4BHNlYwN5bnN1YmNhdA--
also available at her site, which is painfully slow right now:
http://www.anncoulter.com/cgi-local/printer_friendly.cgi?article=100
PG - ironically, "cocksucker" could be considered a slur against gays :-)
Which makes me wonder... if the murdering black man were also gay, would calling him a "cocksucker" be as off-limits as calling him "n*gger"? Are you saying that it's only considered sporting to insult him if what I say is a lie, or am I misinterpreting?
Kevin - If I wanted to put a positive spin on Ann's remarks, I'd say that she's intentionally disrespecting militant muslims to show that she doesn't fear their terrorist threats.
Or it could very well be that she's just a rude, loud-mouthed, hate-monger who gets a perverse pleasure from being unnecessarily crude in public.
I don't read Ann Coulter on a regular basis, so I don't know if this is just some over-the-top schtick she does for comedic effect, or if she's just a loon. I'm not qualified to say.
Posted by: Harvey at February 16, 2006 09:32 AM (ubhj8)
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Towelhead would have been more approriate.
Posted by: spacemonkey at February 16, 2006 12:24 PM (DN55C)
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Is "nigger" even an insult anymore? All the gansta rappers call themselves and their friends that.
Posted by: Deathknyte at February 16, 2006 07:03 PM (cdtR7)
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Isn't "raghead" more of a
cultural slur? No one is born with a piece of cloth attached to his head. A minor point, possibly, because people don't choose the culture they are born into any more than they choose their skin color but they can choose how they respond to and participate in their culture.
Posted by: Lynn S at February 17, 2006 08:07 AM (cZY6q)
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January 16, 2006
CAN THE NSA MONITOR INTERNATIONAL PHONE CALLS?... MAYBE... (UPDATED 1-17-06)
If you're interested in
the NSA phone-tapping controversy, The Volokh Conspiracy does a thorough - but still readable -
examination of some case law surrounding the issue. I'd recommend this post as the BARE minimum for you to know before attempting to discuss the matter at your next cocktail party or Democratic Underground comment flame.
Having read it, I'm still a bit undecided on the technical legality of it, but more sure that I don't have a problem with it. Here's what I mean:
1) Article 2 of the Constitution gives the President the authority to warrantlessly monitor completely-foreign communications.
2) The Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act forbids the warrantless monitoring of domestic communications.
The NSA program warrantlessly monitors communications that involve one end in the US, and one end in a foreign country, and there's no solid legal precedent for saying whether the situation falls under area 1 or area 2.
That's how things ARE.
As for how they SHOULD be, it comes down to the following question:
Do you fall on the side protecting the privacy of US citizens, even if it means extending the protections to their foreign contacts; or do you fall on the side of monitoring foreigners, even if it means monitoring US citizens?
Because we're at war, I'm willing to stand for the second option, mostly because these are marginal cases, and I don't see this escalating toward an approval of purely domestic warrantless wiretaps.
Feel free to disagree in the comments, if you're so inclined.
Meanwhile, (via the Puppy Blender), The American Thinker recalls (and quotes) the New York Times nodding approvingly about Bill Clinton's warrantless eavesdropping via ECHELON.
UPDATE 1-17-06 _Jon of We Swear points out a post at Power Line wherein some more on-point case law suggests that Article II trumps FISA when it comes to warrantless international searches.
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A couple things -
1) Article 2 gives the Pres the ability to do what is needed to protect the country in a time of war.
2) Article 2 cannot be over-ridden by acts of Congress. FISA is nice, but meaning-less / powerless in this situation. It requires an Amendment to limit the Pres's powers during war.
3) Congress gave the Pres war powers a few years ago. So even if FISA did apply, that neutered it.
Besides, Clinton did *much* worse - go read "Spying - two Sides" at my site.
(The preview thing *above* is annoying. This dialog keeps getting pushed down.)
Posted by: _Jon at January 16, 2006 10:00 AM (/R7YK)
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_Jon - Agreed about FISA likely being - in fact - an unconstitutional limitation on the President's powers. However, that question hasn't actually come before the judiciary yet, so the matter is
technically still undecided.
Oh, and I'm looking into tweaking the live preview thingy.
Posted by: Harvey at January 16, 2006 10:15 AM (ubhj8)
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How about we do the actual monitoring IN a foreign country? i.e. setup the monitoring equipment in England. Then we're really only monitoring the airwaves in a foreign country...
Posted by: Ogre at January 16, 2006 10:57 AM (/k+l4)
4
Here you go:
http://powerlineblog.com/archives/012631.php
http://powerlineblog.com/archives/012631.php
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Posted by: accident insurance at June 29, 2006 02:21 PM (K1uNf)
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January 09, 2006
DOES ANYONE ELSE THINK INSTAPUNDIT'S BEING A LITTLE UPPITY HERE?
Glenn Reynolds
criticizes high-interest lenders like
LoanMax thusly:
"many of the deals offered by a lot of these loan outfits are so bad that it's hard to believe anyone agrees to them understanding what's going on."
Easy for HIM to say. He's a lawyer with an IQ of 170. He understands EVERYTHING.
For the rest of the country - especially the half with sub-100 IQ's and no training in legalese - every legal and financial form is just so much unread gobbledygook. They rely on what they're told by the smiling lender on the other side of the text, and they mostly only want to know two things:
What day of the month are the payments due?
and
How much are they?
Yet Reynolds insists that that's not enough. If borrowers don't care about interest rates, then it's obviously because they're being craftily misled by spiky-toothed loan-sharks:
"The interest rates are so absurdly high that merely spelling out the deal would seem to be evidence that the borrower probably didn't realize what was involved."
Here's a different theory: They realize just fine. However, they don't give a shit.
Take for example, a female acquaintance of mine, who is not named Carol.
She had a credit card from a local furniture store (she LOVED furniture & decorative doo-dads), which she more or less kept maxed out - around $1000. As soon as it got paid down below the credit limit, she'd be back in the store getting more crap.
Making minimum payments every month at 18% interest.
Meanwhile she had about $2000 tucked away in a savings account pulling less than 1% interest.
Personally, I thought she was being stupid, and tried to explain it to her, but she wouldn't listen. The ONLY thing she based her spending decisions on was "Can I make the monthly payments?" Nothing else mattered. She looked at her credit card bill NOT as something that could be paid off, but as a recurring debt, much like water, electricity, or phone bills. Do you ever worry about how to "pay off" your utilities?
HELL no!
So is it really that shocking that some people would view their credit card bills the same way?
And - truth be told - this "living paycheck-to-paycheck" point of view, while short-sighted, isn't quite as moronic as it appears at first glance. As a practical matter, there's no downside to it IF you stay healthy and work (or otherwise maintain a steady income) until you retire or die.
Of course, failing to plan ahead like this makes for a train-wreck if either your health or employment goes awry, but it's NOT the responsibility of LoanMax, or Rent-A-Center, or CheckAdvance, or ANY other high-risk, high-interest lender to ensure that the borrower is living a prudent, forward-thinking life. If borrowers value immediate gratification more than they value getting a good interest rate, that's their option, and it's no sin for the lender to offer them the opportunity to indulge themselves. Just like it's not McDonald's fault for making me fat if I choose to go in there and eat six Big Macs a day.
And let's be honest here. If you outlaw LoanMax, these dim bulbs that actually use their overpriced services will just find another bad deal to piss their money away on, because making imprudent choices is simply what they do.
Posted by: Harvey at
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You're dead on here.
But North Carolina still recently banned any "payday lending" companies in the state.
Why? Because North Carolina is home to a large number of very large banks -- who contribute a lot to politicians and who do NOT like competition...
Posted by: Ogre at January 09, 2006 08:46 AM (/k+l4)
Posted by: Susie at January 09, 2006 09:57 AM (a0oF7)
3
Personally I can never ever think of a time that I would need to use the services of one of those types of places. They are nothing more then legalized loan sharking. Why do people use them? You could be right, they just want the instant gratification. Maybe they're just financially stupid. I don't know.
Posted by: Contagion at January 09, 2006 12:18 PM (Q5WxB)
4
As somone who knows a lot on the subject and has been known to actually - you know - *read* the contract, I can see both points.
What should be shown on the contracts is the amount the interest increases the purchase price.
They shouldn't be outlawed, but they should be regulated.
As something close to a Libertanian, I believe the FedGov should do something to prevent ignorant peeps (that's not an insult - stupid is an insult) from being ripped off. The contract should be simple and clear. Even for revolving credit (which is what a credit card is).
Posted by: _Jon at January 09, 2006 03:55 PM (/R7YK)
5
I also wonder... who's actually upset about this? Is it people who sign up for high interest loans who are pissed because a friend of theirs got a better deal elsewhere & they missed out? Is it lawyers who think they smell some blood in the water? Is it politicians looking to squeeze the industry for some campaign contributions?
I suspect that it's people who aren't a party to any of these contracts who are making the fuss, and I'm always leery of third-party interventions. Especially since it's my experience that people who go in for this stuff wouldn't care if the contract said "110% APR" in huge, red letters right above the signature line. They just want their stuff.
As for being ignorant... well, getting ripped off is a good way to learn a healthy dose of caution... of course, so is getting advice from those who know better.
Anyway, I'm generally against government regulation designed to help people who simply don't bother to ask enough questions.
Posted by: Harvey at January 09, 2006 07:15 PM (ubhj8)
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December 27, 2005
GUY TALK
On occasion, I get people asking about some of the comments left by
Madfish Willie. They'll say something like, "What's up with him? How come you let him troll your comments like that?"
Troll?
Hell, that ain't trolling, that's male bonding.
#1 guy rule - if someone you like says something rude, it's meant as a compliment. It's a way of saying "I think you're tough enough to take a verbal punch, and I think you're clever enough to give better right back."
Women, however, play a completely different game. With them (all too often) if you say something that can be taken as either completely innocent or mean & hurtful, they'll assume it's the mean & hurtful one (See rule #29).
And oh MY can they be acrobatic about extracting the wrong meaning.
Probably a habit formed over a lifetime of talking with other women, since when one woman says something ambiguous to another woman, she's usually getting in a cleverly-disguised little dig.
It's simply too unladylike to be mean in an upfront fashion, ya know. Gotta be catty about it.
On the other hand, maybe my mind's been poisoned from watching "Desperate Housewives".
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You've been watching Desperate Housewives?
Doesn't that make you a woman?
Posted by: Contagion at December 27, 2005 08:18 AM (Q5WxB)
2
TNT watches it and she won't let me have the remote :-(
THAT'S what makes me a woman :-D
Posted by: Harvey at December 27, 2005 08:25 AM (ubhj8)
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See, this is why I have hardly any friends that are girls. They generally can't handle the abuse I constantly spew. Men seem to make better friends because they just say it how it is, and pick on you to your face instead of behind your back. You always know where you stand with a guy friend. Women, I just can't figure out. Funny because I am a woman!
Posted by: Sarah at December 27, 2005 11:29 AM (UKWHw)
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Heh. You're SO going to love Contagion :-D
Posted by: Harvey at December 27, 2005 01:07 PM (ubhj8)
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What's that supposed to mean you slack jawed hill billy?
Posted by: Contagion at December 27, 2005 02:34 PM (Q5WxB)
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I watched part of Desperate Housewives once - I thought the writing was really good. I talk out loud when watching TV, usually predicting what the person should say. In many cases, they said what I have. Which is pretty rare. (Without the swearing, of course.)
Contagion: that's pretty funny right 'der.
Posted by: _Jon at December 27, 2005 04:21 PM (/R7YK)
7
Didn't I get the same thing once from one of the broads here? And she thought that http://www.donotremove was some sort of dummy address?
Posted by: Phelps at December 30, 2005 10:58 AM (KAQTS)
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December 01, 2005
HOW TO EXERCISE FREE SPEECH
Blogson-in-law Alex of Alex in Wonderland is
contemplating the meaning of the phrase "freedom of speech". Although in America it's usually discussed as a legal matter, he also makes note that - in a broader view - it's possible to have your freedom curtailed by peer pressure, even if it doesn't amount to a rights violation, per se.
Which brings me to the topic of how to voice objectionable opinions.
We all have opinions that other people wouldn't like, and we usually know it before speaking them. Yet sometimes the information is interesting or important. So what do you do?
My suggestion: stay calm, stick to facts, and limit yourself to a short, conclusory paragraph at the end, instead of interspersing the facts with copioius ranting invective.
For example, let's say that I'm disgusted by some things that certain black people are doing. I need to make it clear that it's motivated by hatred of stupidity, and not hatred of blacks in toto. I'd probably write something like this:
Stupid people need to keep quiet.
Or the MSM needs to speak up.
Because I haven't heard much about:
Louis Farrakan, who recently said "FEMA is too White to represent us and so is the Red Cross."
Or Kamau Kambon, who gave a speech a while back and said "We have to exterminate white people off the face of the planet" (audio clip of speech here)
By the way, did anyone else know that some free blacks actually owned slaves? I don't mean just buying family members, I'm talking about a plantationful.
Wonder how the reparations crowd plans to handle that?
Oh, and there's a tendency for "people of color" not to get prosecuted under "hate crime" laws.
And does anyone remember when the Neo-Nazis marched in Toledo against "black gang violence"... at which point black gang members violently rioted in the streets? Pegged the irony meter, it did.
What's my point?
Just saying that white people don't have a monopoly on stupidity, that's all.
Another option is to whip up
a bitter, shrieking screed full of typos and bad grammar, and avoid including most of the explanatory linkage that would support my points.
And then dump the steaming pile in the comments at IMAO... say in someone's Filthy Lie Assignment.
Of course, if I did that, then SarahK would rewrite the comment to make me look foolish, my message would be completely lost, and my exercise of free speech in this case would be futile.
So I agree with Alex - don't be afraid speak your mind. However, DO keep your audience in mind and make your controversial points simply, clearly, factually, and (if possible) with supportive linkage.
Remember, if a free speech falls in a forest and no one sticks around to hear it, it doesn't actually make a sound.
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... Or start your own blog and say whatever you want.
Posted by: _Jon at December 01, 2005 08:24 AM (g9Y9+)
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This is the stupidest thing you've ever written! I demand you delete it now!
Actually, I think everyone should just say what they think and feel. They just need to be preparred for the backlash of dissenting oppinion. IE this is your blog if you wanted to go off on how you feel that there is a huge double standard on what is considered racist and equal opportunity, go for it. If the MSM pick up on it and give out your address, you may get flooded with visitors that strongly disagree with you.
Thus comments galore telling you that you are a moron. It's your freedom to spout off and it's thier freedom to respond.
Posted by: Contagion at December 01, 2005 09:19 AM (Q5WxB)
3
Well, I'm glad you linked to Alex's post because I only found out yesterday that Sally was contemplating giving up the blog. I need to email her because now I know why she's doing it.
Blogging as free speech is a bit of a problem because morons will tend to respond to you either through comments or email and it's very difficult not to be hurt by their blatherings. Even if you do state things calmly and factually, there are often people who will go nuts over it. Then the delete key becomes your best friend. After all, as _Jon said - they can get their own blog and blather.
Posted by: Teresa at December 01, 2005 01:30 PM (FZwDL)
4
Oh no doubt you will get called a racist because you dared to go outside the political correct norm. But I have found that those who call me racist cannot refute the facts so they resort to words of insults to cover their inadaquacy of logic. Now, if I could yell insults loud enough to cover my inadequacy of spelling and typing
Posted by: GUYK at December 01, 2005 06:05 PM (hGIvu)
5
What's the fun of having a blog if you don't have people disagree? I love the occasional troll because I get the chance to slam on them with basic logic. Usually they will label me a
Nazi and run.
Posted by: SeanS at December 02, 2005 12:57 AM (cEjQ0)
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